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Lack of Communication - Is it really that hard? - I've been thinking about this thread (and other's like it...they seem to come along every few months or so, along with the ones about whether or not condoms are a good idea or whether we're just caving to the big latex conglomerates) and I have a few additional thoughts. First, many (most?) emails we receive seem to have about as much thought put into them as one might put into which side of their hamburger to start eating on. If they aren't spammed out to multiple people the senders, at very least, don't seem to have the verbal capacity to write anything beyond, "We seen yer add and wanna put our naughty bits in yer naughty bits." [SIC] Is it that hard to include a little tidbit or two about WHY you think we might be a good match for you and why we would want to take time out of our busy lives to meet with you? And the few that DO contain more than a generic greeting or poorly thought out pick up line have obviously not read our profile (don't necessarily blame them...takes a minimum of a couple of hours to slog through) and don't know what we are and are not looking for. For Christ's sake, give us at least ONE compelling reason why you think we'd like to meet you such as, "We love fisting out stuffed ferrets too and also worship Satan as our lord and master. Let's have coffee." Second, when did we all become such Tender Heart Care Bears? And why do we necessarily feel entitled to a response to a more often than not spammed out email from people wanting to perv our locked pics? I've only written back to that nice Nigerian prince like ten or fifteen times before I finally got tired of him asking for my checking account number. Do you call back every carpet cleaning company that leaves a message on your voice mail? Do you send a nice polite note back the the guy who's running for president for the Violent Tyrannical Dictator Party and wants you to donate to his campaign fund? I mean, he was even nice enough to send you a self addressed stamped envelope. So maybe put a little thought into your solicitations. Give people a compelling reason to write you back beyond, "OMG, you're swingers? We're swingers too. We should totally fuck!". This goes double for single guys. Read the profile...even if you have to do it over two or three nights and use a dictionary to look up the big words. Take note of what people are and aren't looking for and especially if they mention your particular demographic. And last but not least, Don't worry about it if someone doesn't write you back. For all you know they've just survived a horrific bumper car accident at Lagoon or maybe they're 2 days in to binge watching all nine seasons of Matlock and haven't eaten or slept for two days. If you're consistently not getting any responses to your emails maybe you're fishin' in the wrong pond. Take a good long hard look in the mirror and ask yourself honestly if Angelina Jolie REALLY would like to fuck you or if you're more likely to hit it off with Steve Buscemi or Nick Nolte. [img]http://41.media.tumblr.com/5aeb01c341f821494d4f928ab96c1ed0/tumblr_n9id25LoID1skhtbpo1_500.jpg[/img] [img]http://images.complex.com/complex/image/upload/t_article_image/tkv4iaprkfruehfvnhpn.jpg[/img]

Appropriate Parameters of Sexual Conduct in Modern Society - Should sex still have a unique status or just be another hobby? - Beard, You did open something up but I'm not sure what. I had to copy and paste your original here so I didn't miss or get too confused.. One of your last points first: Moral refers to standards as defined by the church, the government or your neighbors(in light of the Supreme Court decission a few years ago about porn) Ethics, on the other hand are something that we define for ourselves based on our upbringing/environment and values that we have defined based on whatever we base them on. You are right that marriage is a concept designed by religion and the government for the care of offspring and the clear definition of linage for property rights. You use the term marriage, which is a legal term like it is a moral imperative then ask if it should be based on some one or group of common interrests. Then the next breath you suggest that marriage is supposed to be more than any of that and something to do with sharing and intimacy. Finally you go back to somehow trying to make a point, (I'm not sure what that point was) that maybe there should be a conglomerate of reasons for marriage then with the nesxt breath you ask if sex should be forbidden.. Now lets see if this makes any sense to anyone. I'm poly and We swing. I have a lover who is married and her husband knows or us(he is not poly) and B knows of us and we are all good friends. We are, my lover and I, intimate both emotionally and sexually and both non poly mates knowof this. B and I are very much soulmates but then my lover is also very close to that as well. I do not wish to take her away from her husband and I do not wish to replace B. She does not want to replace her husband with me and we are alll OK with that arrangement. In my heart of heart I am married to both in a very intimate way although I do not wish to procreate with anyone anymore. She feels the same way toward me. I would submit that marriage is an intimate, emotional and sometimes physical union of people.. I did not say two people I said people. We have been taught sex as a negative thing and relationships with more than one as a negative thing because we cannot love more than one person or more than one at any one time... I submit that we can love more than one and that the more we love the more we get back from that... Swinging is started off as fun between close friends and sometimes the term wife swapping became a reality.... Sex is fun adn swinging is about sex and today alot of times about relationships. Relationships in my opinion are for the benefit of everyone involved... . So I'm not sure if I understood where you were going but this is my take on the propositions as I understood them. Depending on any person's opinion or preferences sex and love can be the same or they can be separate or they can be coincidental but it's basically up to that person or couple to make that determination.... We, in the lifestyle, may ultimately be right and marriage may change to a more contractual thing rather than some sacrosanct BS that it has become.... Swingers as a group have more than 3.4 time greater chance of remaining married than that of non swingers. The range of failed marriages is between 66 and 77% in all first and second marriages and some 70% of all married people cheat on their mates. Swinger have a better than 85% chance of marriage survival. Cheating is not exempt in Swinging but I think is is greatly reduced... I think as swingers we have sex with friends and it can be just that or it can be more... at least for me..

Couples Copulating - How the hell do ya match up? - It is the same for probably 85% of us hun. 4 years in the lifestyle and we are still looking for the perfect match up for all 4. Yes, it does happen, but it is not easy to find the right couple and them feel the same way. WAY more times than not, someone is taking one for the team. We have a rule against that, but I am here to tell you that everyone sees something different in everyone.. Very many people get a bit upset when half of the party is very interested and the other half is not. Example: I find a woman at a party very interesting and sexy and she feels the same about me. Well, chances are that my wife or her hubby is not interested. Well, we have been down this road so many times that we just changed our rules to = "OK, have a good time". This sometimes still does not work as the other couple is still in the (COUPLES ONLY) mode... When it hits right and everyone has a great time it makes all the waiting worth it, but until someone lowers their standards you will be part of the 85%.. The other 15% are made up of: We play separately. Everything DOES gel. Hard core swingers and ok, take one for the team. The hardest part is when someone in the "said 4-sum" is not going there and sometimes people feel hurt. What everyone needs to remember is that we DO THIS FOR FUN and we are NOT all exactly what everyone else wants. DON'T TAKE IT PERSONAL...... Remember it's all about fun and excitement. If something doesn't feel right, DON'T DO IT!!!! Just keep on having fun with all the people that share the fun in the lifestyle and before you know it you'll be sitting around the table the next morning talking about how much fun you had the night before....

Other activities? - Do you only meet swingers for sex? - No it is not just for sex although that is a really fun part of it. Some of the things we have done with couples that we swing with inlude, going out to dinner, go to a movie together, go to a play, go to a concert, go shoot some pool toether, go bowling, invite them up to our cabin for the weekend (yes we have had couples come spend an entire weekend at the cabin and not play even though we had before and since). We like to go hiking together, fix a fun dinner in at our place in town or at the cabin and enjoy. Other things have included some plane old fashioned helping out stuff like working equipment or building something. Lots of things we like besides fun and frolic in the bedroom, but we like that too.

Are swingsites next? - - It seems that the theocratic power structure keeps trying to create a community exclusive to their vision of Zion through the acquisition of real estate. City Creek being their latest venture. It never really works, since fair housing laws make it impossible for anyone to completely eliminate people from buying property not of their faith. Certain communities do seem to gravitate toward certain neighborhoods. Once hipsters, for example start to move into a low price neighborhood, little by little businesses start to arrive that cater to their taste. The thought is that once you start to see the night life, or even the lack thereof, start to reflect certain taste in a neighborhood, then the property becomes more desirable to people who share the same taste. If the people the neighborhood attracts have money to spend the property values go up. I don't know. If swingers started to buy properties in a particular neighborhood, in numbers sufficient, that it affected the community's cash flow, then would it be possible, that the local cafes, coffee shops, bars and such might not all become somewhat swinger friendly without really say it? I know that I have been asked by gay men in a coffee shop, and in the Smith's in the 9th and 9th neighborhood of Salt Lake City if I am gay, and the gentlemen never seem at all worried about asking the question, nor offended when I tell them I am not. The surrounding neighborhood is a bit friendlier to the LGBT community than much of the rest of the city. I don't think a question like that is always a pick up line, but it is a valid question as a point of reference. Why shouldn't someone be able to ask a question like that? If the LGBT community has some areas of town, that are somewhat more of a comfortable safe space, then why not the non-monogamous? Is that happening anywhere?

BBW Couples in Salt Lake Area? - Newbies - Hey guys, My wife and I are completely newbies to the swingers lifestyle, we have had couple of threesomes fmf and some soft swap with another couple. We would like to find and develop friendships with BBW females and BBW couples, and take it to the next level. We have the idea of making friends in/out bedroom and have lots of fun. We have tried Craiglist before with no luck we realized theres nothing safer than this. Feel free to message us, send us a friend request. Thank you.

Taking one for the team - Yay or nay - Here Here DARKNLADYJEDI Aka Barbi :p but yeah alot of swingers on here are becoming so picky about the physical they forget all about the sexual side. Its a fuck just like gettin drunk and pickin up a pratical stranger in a bar pratically.

Northern Utah Party ... Damn It! - We WILL hunt you down ... - I know this is a long rambling post. I hope you'll humor me. My intentions are good! :) I'm completely un-associated with the party heretofore mentioned. Wow--that sounded like lawyer-speak! OK, so there's a party coming up on Saturday in the Ogden area. I'm pretty much an expert on it 'cause I don't know the hosts, don't know the venue, and have never been there. [em]Emo_59[/em] But I've been to the Draper area version and can tell you that it's very classy. We're goin, but we may not be your cup-o-tea. But looking at the guest list, there are some VERY sexy folks planning on being in attendance. Ask yourself, why aren't YOU on that list? Now I've heard, here-'bouts, that it's kinda difficult to meet up with swinger-type people on here (or elsewhere). I'd not disagree. Having said that, wouldn't it be a good idea to support those folks who organize such parties? And show up, so that they continue? So that even more venues/parties are available in the future? So that more like-minded couples appear before your very eyes at similar parties? [b]Reasons NOT to go to the party:[/b] [i]You're shy[/i]. Screw you, so am I, now get yer ass to this party so that we can be shy together. [em]Emo_12[/em] Seriously, I'm so goofy on here that people expect me to be some kind-a comic in-person. I ain't. I'm shy. The written word is more my forte'. I've got to push myself (and quiet hubby) in order to attend these things. We always have fun and always meet at least a few new people. And everyone attending this party has agreed not to be "clique-ish" and to push their comfort zone by introducing themselves to at least three other couples/groups that they don't know, and to invite those couples into their inner circle. OK, they really haven't promised that. But they will after they read this. Or I'll bring that riding crop that I bought for the "50 Shades" party and beat them senseless with it. [i]You're new to swinging[/i]. I can't think of a better way to ease into it. These are not all out everyone rip their clothes off orgy kinda things. Why not? 'Cause the prudes won't let me have my way, DAMN IT! Errr...skip that last sentence. Anyhoo, there's typically some darkened rooms where, sure enough, folks are "smooching". Smooching may be a slight understatement. But the voyeurs peek in, the exhibitionists go for it, and us in-between types do a bit of both. No pressure, the comfort level and level of participation is up to you. A GREAT introduction to the swing scene. [i]Too Expensive.[/i] Crawl outa yer freakin' cave, would ya? [em]Emo_79[/em] Here's seven letters for ya that explain it: "Open Bar." Of course there's ususally some light snacks as well. And like I said, if you go to the right room, NAKED PEOPLE. Yeah, I know, makes that last porno DVD you bought seem overpriced, doesn't it? And hell, for me personally, hubby doesn't drink, and if I hit more than three drinks I typically wake up flat on my back, naked, legs spread, wondering why the hell I'm feeling so sore "down there." [em]Emo_85[/em] So yeah, I keep it to 3 drinks or less, but still feel that we get our $25 bucks worth as a couple. [i]You're an overbearing, pushy, arrogant, obnoxious, azzhole.[/i] Yer right. You really should stay home and enjoy some "alone time". [b]Reasons to Cum to the Party[/b]: [i]Lets be honest here[/i]: Who DOESN'T like to Cum, right? [i]Swingers are NOT just gonna fall right into your lap[/i]. Unless you come to this party. Or I hit the four drinks previously mentioned. Then gently ease my legs back together, would ya? [i]Even if you might be shy, you can meat, errr..."Meet", potential folks[/i] that you might want to communicate or hang out with later. Even vicariously as you see the interactions among other folks, you may just find some folks you're interested in. [i]There are lots of nooks and crannys[/i]. It's my understanding that there are various nooks, crannies, bedrooms, sitting areas, etc where people may gather. It can actually be a more intimate type thing than you might expect, so if you ARE shy, it's not like you've got to "perform" before a huge audience. OK, sorry, end of rant. I just feel it's a bit like politics. If you don't fully participate, quit yer bitchin! I'm not even going to attempt to articulate the names of the various party hosts that provide for such gatherings and venues. We have a great appreciation for their time and efforts and for sticking their necks out to do it ... you are ALL awesome. :) Oh, and if you do cum? Say Hi, OK? If you find a wild-haired redhead humping on your leg like a 2 year old un-neutered Irish Setter? That'll be me. [em]Emo_54[/em]

D&D free? - is this an oxymoron? - As I've been pondering all the intriguing aspects of this new world we are entering, something doesn't mesh in my mind. We live in a nation where billions (at least multi-millions) are spent daily to advertise drugs. This is done because it enables the drug companies to make multi-billions selling drugs. You can get prescription drugs for everything from your pecker to your severe depression about your pecker! And this is only the legal/prescription drug industry - I imagine the illegal drug business is even bigger. Just exactly where do all these drugs go? I suppose a lot are consumed by folks who have minimal concerns about engaging in high risk activities? Hmmm..... swingers?nah? Fact is the math would indicate that there is a lot more coursing through the veins of just about everyone we encounter than just the good ol redwhite&blue! Same goes for disease. I don't believe the existence of most of it is caused by long-term monogamous relationships. When you are only as safe as the very last physical contact you have and you deal in a world of relative strangers, well, you get the picture. I hope these are not interpreted to be negative comments. I truly am just trying to figure out the mentality of the profiles I read. It strikes me the whole "d&d free" thing is either a formality/some sort of cover-your-ass disclaimer or just people kidding themselves.

Franknfelicity - Honesty - As per a recent request I will post that this is a local issue in Utah, And I suppose I should expect the anonymity that is so precious to all the closet swingers in this area. I apologize to those from outside our twilight zone. But also envy your freedom of choice without judgment